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Author Topic: 4x04 - Daring Don't  (Read 13658 times)

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December 11, 2013, 09:12:55 PM
Reply #150
Eh.. I'm honestly fine with the show ignoring that the mane 6 should be famous. Sure it's a off when you think about it, but can you really blame the show? The amount of conflicts that would end simply because Twilight or Rainbow Dash or somepony showed her face would be absurd.

But Twilight is a princess now if any pony doesn't know her they will be the STUPIDEST MLP FIM CHARACTER EVER! Sorta but she would so get sorta mobbed by fans/ponies that likes her or if they have a issue they go to her, she's a princess the whole "not every pony would know her" can't happen anymore for her as she's a princess the only way a pony wouldn't know her is if  they were outside of Equestria.


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December 12, 2013, 08:18:49 AM
Reply #151
But Twilight is a princess now if any pony doesn't know her they will be the STUPIDEST MLP FIM CHARACTER EVER! Sorta but she would so get sorta mobbed by fans/ponies that likes her or if they have a issue they go to her, she's a princess the whole "not every pony would know her" can't happen anymore for her as she's a princess the only way a pony wouldn't know her is if  they were outside of Equestria.

This is kinda Daring Do we're talking about. The ponified expy of Indiana Jones.

Indiana Jones seeing a leader around might surprise him at least. But I'm assuming he'd continue on with his adventure, especially if that leader happens to be helping him (Which is the case for Daring). But if you really want more characters recognizing the Mane 6 for what they've done. Then have this alternate take on it if Daring knew everything about Rainbow Dash xD


December 12, 2013, 10:30:26 AM
Reply #152
This is kinda Daring Do we're talking about. The ponified expy of Indiana Jones.

Indiana Jones seeing a leader around might surprise him at least. But I'm assuming he'd continue on with his adventure, especially if that leader happens to be helping him (Which is the case for Daring). But if you really want more characters recognizing the Mane 6 for what they've done. Then have this alternate take on it if Daring knew everything about Rainbow Dash xD

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Yes but I had to post that because of what I was replying too,

Quote
Eh.. I'm honestly fine with the show ignoring that the mane 6 should be famous. Sure it's a off when you think about it, but can you really blame the show? The amount of conflicts that would end simply because Twilight or Rainbow Dash or somepony showed her face would be absurd.

with Twilight as a princess that can't be avoided anymore everypony should know who she is or be totally stupid/out of Equestia. P.S funny comic but I was talking about Twilight in a reply to a comment about ponies not knowing who the Mane6 were. Offtopic sorry but had to post that reply as the show can no long have ponies (at the very least) be unaware of who Twilight is and likewise her friends a little bit since she thanked them at her crowning party so for ponies not to know who any of them are, yeah it's sorta OK like it was in Rarity's season 2 episode but now it'll be stupid sorta as everyone pony should know who they are.

Daring Do I can imagine she wouldn't as well look how far her home was (was she affect by the season opener?) and she's a adventurer she wouldn't stay in one place for very long and maybe even traveled outside Equestria so for her not to know the Mane6 I can forgive, but everypony else that does live in Equestria? NO! Not anymore can that be forgiven so easily now that Twilight is a princess.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2013, 09:44:42 AM by Speedy »


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December 12, 2013, 08:29:15 PM
Reply #153
Eh.. I'm honestly fine with the show ignoring that the mane 6 should be famous. Sure it's a off when you think about it, but can you really blame the show? The amount of conflicts that would end simply because Twilight or Rainbow Dash or somepony showed her face would be absurd.
Well, this opens up a complicated issue, and it's something I brought up with the concept of Discord being a good guy; if what you're doing can easily solve a situation, so much so that you have to come up with reasons not to use it or write around it, then why did you introduce it in the first place?  You either DON'T make the mane 6 heroes or you DON'T put them in situations where their fame can help them solve problems, simple as that.  I'd rather that they ACKNOWLEDGE this fact rather then just act like it never happened...  which is often the case in this show.

Really, the show's inconsistencies are what drive me crazy the most, and it's hard to say "I love this show" when most of the stuff you're hearing from me is how much I'm complaining about it.  Really, the writing of this show is probably the worst aspect of this show, for me, as everything else is awesome.

December 13, 2013, 09:55:32 AM
Reply #154
Well, this opens up a complicated issue, and it's something I brought up with the concept of Discord being a good guy; if what you're doing can easily solve a situation, so much so that you have to come up with reasons not to use it or write around it, then why did you introduce it in the first place?  You either DON'T make the mane 6 heroes or you DON'T put them in situations where their fame can help them solve problems, simple as that.  I'd rather that they ACKNOWLEDGE this fact rather then just act like it never happened...  which is often the case in this show.

Really, the show's inconsistencies are what drive me crazy the most, and it's hard to say "I love this show" when most of the stuff you're hearing from me is how much I'm complaining about it.  Really, the writing of this show is probably the worst aspect of this show, for me, as everything else is awesome.

I have to agree the consistencies of parts are rarely remembered heck Apple Family Reunion took place on the Summer Sun  event, well the day before as Celestia was to rise the sun that night but season 3 had a whole episode around it and the whole "100 moons" sorta makes a plothole unless you think about it hard anough and decide it's a few monhs/years but...season 4's opener revealed the entire seasons 1-3 took place in 1 year but did that reunion episode took place a day before the opener?

I doubt it because ALICORN TWILIGHT EPISODE! That so took place after the reunion which makes a plothole out of that whole episode as it's suppose to be a day before the event unless it is every 100/nights, what else...well season 1 had inconsistencies but I can forgive as it was stated (but can that statement be truthful?) the episodes were out of order. The inconsistencies are a big issue and the writers really need to alk to each other or watch the other writers' episodes if a writer is gonne take a story that involves a past episode's story.

The whole "Mane6 are heroes but no pony cares peroid as they don't know them" is one of the biggest consistencies issues, sure the Mane6 getting mobbed by fans (like Fluttershy did in Green Isn't Your Color) by being so great heroes would get annoying but...you know you can show that "once" in a entire episode about it and the Mane6 dealing with such fame and then after it rarely show it as they finally got the fans to stop mobbing them, or something I agree with PiratePony202 if your not gonna use a something don't have that something to begin with, I bet the issues wouldn't be here as much if the writers at least talked once in a while and/or watch each others'' episodes.

EDIT: P.S now that Daring Do is real I'm hoping Rainbow Dash doesn't stop reading her books because...well if she's real and Rainbow loves her books so much...wouldn't she stop reading the books altogether and go to try and live them by helping Daring Do now that their (which was rushed btw) friends?
« Last Edit: December 13, 2013, 09:57:44 AM by Speedy »


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December 13, 2013, 10:29:48 AM
Reply #155
EDIT: P.S now that Daring Do is real I'm hoping Rainbow Dash doesn't stop reading her books because...well if she's real and Rainbow loves her books so much...wouldn't she stop reading the books altogether and go to try and live them by helping Daring Do now that their (which was rushed btw) friends?

I don't know if Rainbow and Daring are friends at the moment. They're more like acquaintances. Yes they worked together to beat Ahuizotl, but it's no different from Indiana Jones having a partner for a short time. Granted there are some in Indiana Jones that become friends like Indy and Sallah are in Raiders of the Lost Ark & Last Crusade. But Rainbow Dash and Daring Do is more like Short Round and Indy in Temple of Doom. Even if of course Rainbow is an older example compared with Short Round. They were together on one adventure. (Technically they had at least another with the novels that take place inbetween or before movies) but they pretty much split off afterward.

Also Rainbow Dash won't just abandon her friends just to hang out more with Daring Do. Rainbow knows now that Daring wants privacy more then anything. She would be going against her element of Loyalty on both accounts (Loyalty to her friends, loyalty to Daring Do) if she continued to pester Daring on her lonesome.

December 13, 2013, 01:50:51 PM
Reply #156
Quote
I bet the issues wouldn't be here as much if the writers at least talked once in a while and/or watch each others'' episodes.

The writers do discuss the episodes (at least in a general since) at the beginning of each season.  Each script is reviewed by Meghan Mcarthy and others for serious issues.

At this point I'm assuming that the ignorance of the Equestrian citizenry at best hasn't come up or at worst is a conscious decision by the staff. I've learned to accept this because it's a kids' show and no kid's show I've ever seen actually tackles the idea of the heroes being honest-to-God world-famous celebrities. 

What really bothers me is that, in addition to being a world savior several times over, Twilight is now a world leader and the writers are ignoring it, when they shouldn't be.

Remember all of those people in the Twilacorn thread that were saying that there was no point in making Twilight an alicorn princess if the show itself was just going to basically ignore it?  It's looking like they were mostly right.  I don't see the show acknowledging Twilight's new status again until the season finale.  :(
« Last Edit: December 13, 2013, 01:51:54 PM by Archlyn »
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December 13, 2013, 02:09:45 PM
Reply #157
Remember all of those people in the Twilacorn thread that were saying that there was no point in making Twilight an alicorn princess if the show itself was just going to basically ignore it?  It's looking like they were mostly right.  I don't see the show acknowledging Twilight's new status again until the season finale.  :(

I actually think there's going to be a bit in-between here. Some episodes, Twilight's new status will be important. (Just that none of the episodes that we know about Season 4 other then the opener are Twilight-central episodes. All Twilight centered episodes I imagine will have something to do with her Princesshood. I doubt the Opener and the Finale will be the only Twilight episodes [Assuming that is indeed what it will be regarding the Finale, but given all the two-parters so far. It's most likely]) But others, especially ones where Twi's not the important character of that particular episode it's not always important to note that. I don't think it was too important in Daring Don't.

You also don't want the complete opposite of not acknowledging Twilight's status: Have them acknowledge it every single second of Twilight's screentime with a character meeting with Twilight with "Omigosh you're a Princess!", "Look at those wings!", etc. where the show literally stops in it's track to remind you that Twilight is a Princess in every single episode. When the wings, and occasionally a crown is all that's necessary for that.

December 13, 2013, 03:44:34 PM
Reply #158
I don't know if Rainbow and Daring are friends at the moment. They're more like acquaintances. Yes they worked together to beat Ahuizotl, but it's no different from Indiana Jones having a partner for a short time. Granted there are some in Indiana Jones that become friends like Indy and Sallah are in Raiders of the Lost Ark & Last Crusade. But Rainbow Dash and Daring Do is more like Short Round and Indy in Temple of Doom. Even if of course Rainbow is an older example compared with Short Round. They were together on one adventure. (Technically they had at least another with the novels that take place inbetween or before movies) but they pretty much split off afterward.

Also Rainbow Dash won't just abandon her friends just to hang out more with Daring Do. Rainbow knows now that Daring wants privacy more then anything. She would be going against her element of Loyalty on both accounts (Loyalty to her friends, loyalty to Daring Do) if she continued to pester Daring on her lonesome.

True but what's stopping Rainbow Dash from you know, going to visit Daring Do unless she moved?


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December 13, 2013, 04:41:37 PM
Reply #159
I actually think there's going to be a bit in-between here. Some episodes, Twilight's new status will be important. (Just that none of the episodes that we know about Season 4 other then the opener are Twilight-central episodes. All Twilight centered episodes I imagine will have something to do with her Princesshood. I doubt the Opener and the Finale will be the only Twilight episodes [Assuming that is indeed what it will be regarding the Finale, but given all the two-parters so far. It's most likely]) But others, especially ones where Twi's not the important character of that particular episode it's not always important to note that. I don't think it was too important in Daring Don't.

I hope you're right. I really do.

You also don't want the complete opposite of not acknowledging Twilight's status: Have them acknowledge it every single second of Twilight's screentime with a character meeting with Twilight with "Omigosh you're a Princess!", "Look at those wings!", etc. where the show literally stops in it's track to remind you that Twilight is a Princess in every single episode. When the wings, and occasionally a crown is all that's necessary for that.

Also true, which is why it didn't bother me at all when nary a word was spoken about Twilight's new title in Castleman-ia. For this episode it was almost tailor-made for Twilight to at least try to exercise her new power.  How hard would it have been to have an exchange like:

Twilight: Stop this right now, Ahuizotl! I won't let you harm innocent ponies!
Ahuizotl: Oh please, princess! I don't see any royal guards here! Wheat are you going to do? Arrest me? *mocking laughter*

...all while Rainbow and Daring are working to get the rings off that pedestal thing
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December 16, 2013, 06:06:30 PM
Reply #160
Rate 10/10 this episode was awesome.

I loved the English accent of the enemies.
And was Pinkie Pie reading the books too? :P :lol: just kidding she was just being herself :D
All in all this episode made my day. :)

Just discovered in this episode Twilight's horn seems longer due to her transformation to alicorn :P

Gosh and I was quite sad when RD seemed to give up... but thanks she had her friends to encourage her to go and put a hoove to help Daring Do to destroy that temple and take the ring. (Yay)
Confront the dark parts of yourself, and work to banish them with illumination and forgiveness. Your willingness to wrestle with your demons will cause your angels to sing.

December 17, 2013, 12:50:46 AM
Reply #161
The best singular episode of the three seen as of yet, to me. Bringing Daring back and into this particular storyline was very cool, fun and entertaining. Dash was adorable throughout the entire thing, Daring was pretty cool, even if she did cold-shoulder all over the place for a little while, and Auhizotl was purely epic, much more so than he was in his storybook premiere apperance.

I will say too many used her fangirling as an excuse to once again throw pointless hate at her character though. It's okay to think she was annoying this episode, as that was the point for much of it; seeing it from Darings' perspective. But I've seen people go on tirades about how this episode has 'back-tracked' the character development she's gotten from taking in Scootaloo, standing up for what she knew was right at the risk of losing her dream in Wonderbolt Academy, etc. Lol. Okay, then :P Apparently characters can't be like real people; can't detour from a streamlined personality. it's not like there are multiple writers, not to mention realistic advanced personalities to deal with or anything.

In other words, just because Dash gives into fangirling doesn't denounce any of character development she's gotten previously, and I know I've been seeing way too many people saying the contrary. I'm not going to lose any of the maturity that I've gained in my life just because I freak out and get excited over the Sox winning a game, so why should Dash be expected to? Everyone's got an inner child, and when your hero comes to life, I'd say you've got some entitlement to revert for a short while until that excitement wears off.

There are still way too many people who walk into episodes with the goal of being a critic, and not a fan.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2013, 12:56:53 AM by ~Chaotic Discord~ »

December 17, 2013, 05:32:41 PM
Reply #162
Maybe it's not being a critic, maybe it really IS just being a fan, and AS a fan, they don't like the direction the show is taking.  I, personally, don't see myself as a critic, even though I can criticize a far amount, but that's only because I have a lot to say and a lot to think about with this and many other shows.  I mean, I didn't hate this episode, and I automatically loved the idea that Daring Do and her supporting case was real, but I can understand why people wouldn't like it, and also, to some degree, why people automatically DON'T like the idea of Daring Do being real.

December 18, 2013, 10:18:23 PM
Reply #163
When one cares so much to the point where they look like nothing but critics who bash things 80% or more of the time than they do seem to enjoy anything at all at face value, that's just how it is in appearance, and can't be changed regardless what the intent is or isn't. I can't personally stand it, because to me, people could chill out a little bit more about it in general. We're not the target audience, we're never going to be, and because we've been along for the ride from the start, people who care to the extents that I've seen, is going too far, in my opinion. If one can't enjoy things at face value and instead of enjoying anything at all, can only pick things apart and focus on the negatives because they 'care so much', they're ultimately missing the point of watching something for entertainment. It's not about being right, it's about enjoyment.
I don't know you, and I'm not bulking you into the category of people I'm talking about, as you probably don't even count under them. I'm talking as far anally right-winged as you can get  ::)
« Last Edit: December 18, 2013, 10:24:42 PM by ~Chaotic Discord~ »

December 18, 2013, 10:35:00 PM
Reply #164
When one cares so much to the point where they look like nothing but critics who bash things 80% or more of the time than they do seem to enjoy anything at all at face value, that's just how it is in appearance, and can't be changed regardless what the intent is or isn't. I can't personally stand it, because to me, people could chill out a little bit more about it in general. We're not the target audience, we're never going to be, and because we've been along for the ride from the start, people who care to the extents that I've seen, is going too far, in my opinion. If one can't enjoy things at face value and instead of enjoying anything at all, can only pick things apart and focus on the negatives because they 'care so much', they're ultimately missing the point of watching something for entertainment. It's not about being right, it's about enjoyment.
I don't know you, and I'm not bulking you into the category of people I'm talking about, as you probably don't even count under them. I'm talking as far anally right-winged as you can get  ::)
Well, I'm sorry, I can't really change how I act or react to things, this is part of who I am.  I don't go in-depth with MLP because I actually enjoy pointing out it's flaws, I point out these flaws because they hinder my enjoyment of the show, and I'm sorry, but I can't just "turn off" this particular mindset of mine.  If I could just "chill out", then I would, but I can't, so sorry if this is "annoying" to you.

I'm also well aware that we're not it's target audience, and in that retrospect, I'd say a lot of this stuff is DEFINITELY passable.  Like I and many others have said time and time again, this is an above-average show and a highlight of modern-day animated television shows, both for kids and adults, and part of me feels that the reason FOR that is that they don't talk down to the kids.  Sure, a lot of can be childish at times, and sometimes it gets REALLY stupid (in fact, continuity hiccups aside, the inconsistency of quality for this show is probably what bothers me the most; it's either REALLY good or REALLY bad with very little middle ground), but compared to the crap Nickelodeon is shoving out, and the fact that Cartoon Network outright REFUSES to even ATTEMPT to appeal to anyone other then young boys, a show like this is practically a blessing.

That being said, I won't stop giving in-depth looks at this show, because like others have said, this show HAS achieved great things, and thus, I shouldn't feel bad for holding it to such standards (though I do keep in mind that it could be much, MUCH worse).  Not to mention, I have a philosophy that only the things that get better the deeper you look into something truly stand the test of time.  It's how we have the likes of Citizen Kane or the like, as shining examples of things that work BECAUSE there's more to them then simply being "entertainment".

December 18, 2013, 10:44:20 PM
Reply #165
But shouldn't it also be OK for entertainment to be just entertainment when it chooses to be so?

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December 18, 2013, 10:51:46 PM
Reply #166
But shouldn't it also be OK for entertainment to be just entertainment when it chooses to be so?
I suppose that's true.  I'm not going to act like if that's ALL you want out of something that somehow makes you any less of a person or whatever nonsense.  I'm just trying to explain my mindset.  Besides, I've been known to just enjoy mindless fun a lot of the time, though it really depends on the "type" of mindless fun.

December 18, 2013, 10:54:26 PM
Reply #167
I suppose that's true.  I'm not going to act like if that's ALL you want out of something that somehow makes you any less of a person or whatever nonsense.  I'm just trying to explain my mindset.  Besides, I've been known to just enjoy mindless fun a lot of the time, though it really depends on the "type" of mindless fun.
I see.

I think, after I go through movies with an artful sense, sometimes mindless fun is exactly what I need. And occasionally, I believe artful entertainment isn't as popular as it can be, because some people already have tons of problems in their lives, and they don't want to deal with the issues of a character on top of that, hence why they hover towards mindless fun, because they get to have fun for two hours and don't have to think about their issues during that time.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2013, 10:56:12 PM by Felix Hawthorne »

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December 18, 2013, 11:01:25 PM
Reply #168
I think it's something to appreciate when a movie, TV show, whatever comes along and can be both entertaining AND have deeper meaning to it.  I know I keep coming back to Wander Over Yonder, but while it did start out as just light-heated fun, certain newer episodes have such strong morals, and helped push the series into being something more then that...  all while still having that light-hearted fun it always had.

Perhaps it's a bit to much to ask that ALL shows be like that, and admittedly, it's hard to pull off, but in a sense, it helps me justify and continue to be critical.  I'll acknowledge if something's still good regardless of how I feel about it, but then again, all I can truly, honestly offer is how I feel about something and that's it. :-\

December 18, 2013, 11:05:51 PM
Reply #169
I think it's something to appreciate when a movie, TV show, whatever comes along and can be both entertaining AND have deeper meaning to it.  I know I keep coming back to Wander Over Yonder, but while it did start out as just light-heated fun, certain newer episodes have such strong morals, and helped push the series into being something more then that...  all while still having that light-hearted fun it always had.

Perhaps it's a bit to much to ask that ALL shows be like that, and admittedly, it's hard to pull off, but in a sense, it helps me justify and continue to be critical.  I'll acknowledge if something's still good regardless of how I feel about it, but then again, all I can truly, honestly offer is how I feel about something and that's it. :-\
Entertainment at large doesnt really try to go for that compromise anymore, I think.

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January 23, 2014, 02:37:51 AM
Reply #170
Also, just in case its not obvious Daring Do is a pony Indiana Jones....we are stuffing so much references to him this episode...

Nah, she's Lara Croft :awesomonster:
Isn't he adorable when he waddles off in anger? :rrwub                                                                               :oostare

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January 25, 2014, 10:50:57 AM
Reply #171
I liked the fact she is a pony version of Indiana Jones.

January 29, 2014, 01:00:49 PM
Reply #172
When I first heard about this episode, I thought it would destroy my headcanon that Rainbow Dash actually believes that Daring Do is possibly a real historical person, and that the knowledge of the book series's author is muddy, and it the stories may be actually older stories... therefore Rainbow Dash could possibly have a religious-like appreciation for Daring Do. The worship, or striving emulation of Daring Do could be a minor religion in Equestria (although, of course, Rarity and possibly Applejack's star worhsip is correct).

But I did not expect it to actually feed that headcanon!

Well, Daring Do was also stubborn and kind of unfriendly, which means she's not the ideal being to worship.

January 31, 2014, 05:07:13 AM
Reply #173